the election

[low_delta]

I got a call from that Brock O'Bama guy today, urging me to vote for him tomorrow.

I like the guy, personally. I dislike Clinton, personally. She engenders no trust. She's an off-the-rack lying Washington politician. Some regard this among her strengths.

Another thing I don't like about Hillary is that she's not very liberal. like Bill before her, she's a moderate. She says she supports liberal causes, but I don't trust her.

When I take those candidate finder quizzes, Clinton and Obama always score within a couple of percentage points of each other. So they're pretty close on the issues, but I don't trust that completely. Like I said, I don't trust Clinton to actually give her support to the causes that she says she's behind. But I'm not sure how much stock I can put in Obama, either. Clinton seems beholden to the lobbyists and big donors. But Obama doesn't really seem to have the ability to get things done. He's new.

So how much sway will he have as president? Can he get health care reform pushed through? That's the one thing that I trust Clinton to get done. Can he get the CIA to scale back torture? Can he push better care of the environment? I think he can manage education reform.

And what about the war? I don't think any new president will be able to bring the troops back from Iraq quickly. That's been some campaign rhetoric, but it's not going to happen. Any president is going to have to work some hard issues to get it done in less than a year. The only difference between Clinton and Obama is that Clinton will be able to better shape the public's opinion of her when she doesn't bring the troops home. Obama's going to look more like a failure.

So like I said, I don't like Clinton. She would be a more "successful" president. But I think Obama would be a better president for me.

Or maybe I'll just vote for Gravel. Is he still in?

Comments

[likethebeer.livejournal.com]

Gravel always scores near the top on those quizzes for me--I think he's still running (but I picked my candidate already).

I've got "VOTE" written on my hand so I don't forget tomorrow! [that's the only palm pilot that seems to work for me.]

[raven-nest.livejournal.com]

I don't think any new president will be able to bring the troops back from Iraq quickly.

*smirk*
Regan coulda done it.. and most people considered him a doof.

You have brought up some very REAL truths here... and that is the hard part. For those of us who believe that someone HAS TO GET IN THERE AND CHANGE what has been done.. correct the current fiasco.. who do you pick? That is the real problem.

My very first election I faced the same situation. The guy I really liked, (and I can't remember who it was, and am not going to go back and research to look it up) was up against Carter as the possible democratic candidate. I liked him better than Carter, but Jimmy had the .. more "real" chance to get elected.. so he is the one I voted for.. my second choice.

I suppose this crap never changes.

[low-delta.livejournal.com]

When will we have a truly good candidate to vote for?

I like Obama, and I'll vote for him. If Clinton is up for president, I'll vote for her. But even Obama doesn't *inspire* me. He'll be fine as president. But I shrug.

For those of us who believe that someone HAS TO GET IN THERE AND CHANGE what has been done.. correct the current fiasco.. who do you pick?
Definitely Obama. Hillary is the business-as-usual candidate. She'll swing things back to center, and advance some liberal causes, but she'll do business they way it's always been done. Obama's only weakness here will be Republican resistance. He'll get a lot of pushback for being "inexperienced." Hillary will get a lot of pushback just because they hate her, so that's a draw between the two. As for Iraq, I'm not certain things will change more quickly than if McCain is elected. He's pro-war, but how many troops are going to stay there, and for how long? How do those numbers change, Clinton vs. McCain? With a Democrat president, I would be very surprised if things moved quickly.

When will we have a truly good candidate to vote for?

[raven-nest.livejournal.com]

True.. it has become (or maybe always was, and I just didn't "see" it) a game of lesser evils.

Re: When will we have a truly good candidate to vote for?

[low-delta.livejournal.com]

It always has been. Sometimes it's worse than others.

[i.livejournal.com]

i said some things in this thread that i think apply to your dilemma. i hope you decide to vote for obama.

http://rpeate.livejournal.com/1630608.html (please excuse the typos, my keyboard isn't always registering my impacts.)

[i.livejournal.com]

oops, sorry, you aren't on his list. here's what i said:

electability is not the issue, even though i might dispute what you claim. hillary and her family have been playing the same old cynical political game of lies and distortions that have so put off the electorate for years. she has taken so much lobbyist and PAC money that she can never claim to be an independent voice for the electorate. if you want the identical 50-50 split we had last election and the one before, with all the young idealists staying home, and if you want the same lobbyist and PAC driven government we've had for decades, vote for hillary. we desperately need for the electorate to be re-involved in the process. that is why you hear so much of that kind of talk from obama and his supporters. his policies are not all that different from hillary's, nor is his experience. his cabinet will likely be similar to what hers would be. the difference is the groundswell of public support that can move even the most entrenched politicos on capitol hill to follow a new president's lead. obama will have that. all hillary would have is the same bitter blue-red divide.

and...

i think that obama is MUCH more likely to be able and inclined to advance the liberal cause without compromise. i think hillary will be forced to compromise away most of her ideals. in fact, i believe she already has.

and...

you see, i believe that much of the liberal agenda is actually a universal agenda, and many of the people across the aisle are there only because of abortion, guns, and taxes. if obama can expose those issues for the red herrings they are, more power to him. if not, i'd rather have a president who will sell out in four or eight years than one who already has. im not a starry eyed leftist who thinks anyone is going to make everything right overnight, robert, but i am sick of the corporatists running my country, and hillary is much more in their pocket than obama.

i left out his comments because it's a private post.

[low-delta.livejournal.com]

Thanks for bringing this up. This is a lot like what runs through my head, and doesn't come out when I ask it to. But then I really didn't intend to go into great detail here.

I am planning on voting for Obama.

To elaborate/clarify one thing I said... Obama hasn't had the power to enact what he wanted to do. Many of his detractors hold that against him. They say he watered down the bill that he wrote, in order to get them passed. Clinton, on the other hand, doesn't have the will to do what she wants to do. To be more specific, she doesn't have the will to do what she originally says she intends to do. She doesn't reluctantly compromise, like Obama, she is quite happy to compromise. Is this because she really doesn't care that much? Or is she caving, and just spinning it like she did it on purpose, to make herself look strong? Either way, it sucks.

[low-delta.livejournal.com]

Electability is important. The winner can only win by getting the swing voters. Republicans will never vote for Clinton. Never. Why? Because she's the antichrist. *shrug* Obama is already shown to have a following among anti-war Republicans. So right there, Obama has the edge. Democrats will vote for McCain. Why? He has a reputation for sticking to his principles. That is one thing that can be counted on to swing voters. Hillary does not have that in her favor, while Obama does. He's charismatic, and seems honest. And when it comes down to it, I dont' think the anti-war Republicans will vote for Obama over McCain, unless that issue trumps all others. I don't think that will be the case for most.

[eyelid.livejournal.com]

I think to get an idea of what Obama can accomplish, you really need to look at his record in the Illinois congress (as opposed to the Senate, where he hasn't had much time). He actually got elected all on his own and worked in a congress significantly, unlike Clinton.

[low-delta.livejournal.com]

I tried looking at his Senate record (in links you posted, I think) but didn't get much out of it because I didn't understand the issues around each bill.

It's good to know he was a strong Representative.