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Just collecting this little rant for my notes...
Not everyone marries in a church. And Barry, you need to do some studying, marriage was around long before the supposed birth of Jesus. It was a contract, often between men by the way, that handled the legality of property.
Also, my wife and I were married by the Justice of the Peace. God had no place, and nothing to do, with our wedding ceremony.
The thing that you, and so many others can't seem to get through your heads- just because YOU believe in your favor of God, and you think it's wrong, who the hell are you to try to pass laws to prevent people that love each other to have the same basic rights as you? In my world, there is love, and there is hatred. There is nothing in the bible saying to judge, or hate others, on god's behalf. There's nothing in there that says to condemn others, hurt others, make the lives of others more miserable on god's behalf.
Bottom line- people using religion to condemn others is wrong. People quoting antiquated passages in a dusty old book can't pick and choose what to believe. Stop eating pork, stop eating shellfish, stop wearing clothing of mixed materials, if you die, your brother marries your wife, take multiple wives,etc. Follow your word of god to the letter, or get off your soapbox. Seriously, if you're going to persecute people based on beliefs, then fucking believe and follow those same laws, the ones written just before and just after the crap you're throwing around as justification for your hatred.
Not everyone believes in god. Not everyone believes in YOUR flavor of god. Not everyone believes the same teachings as you do. Your beliefs are not the default beliefs of the rest of the world. Your beliefs are just as flawed as the other guy's beliefs. You are not right by default. Religions doesn't go with freaking majority rule. Just saying that X amount of people in the world are christians doesn't mean that you're right. It doesn't make your ideas right by default. People are up in arms over the belief system of Muslims. Guess what? THEY think THEY'RE right, and that their religion is the right one, the default religion, the true religion.
What does that mean? It means the world is filled with people following half assed belief systems, each group knowing for SURE that their flavor of god is the right one. Which means the world is filled with groups of people that are entirely wrong in the eyes of the rest of the world. Which means there is room in the world for people with other belief systems than your personal beliefs. You don't fucking condemn people to a life of misery because YOU think your god says it's ok to do so.
The longer I'm on the face of this earth, the more I am filled with anger against self righteous people, clueless individuals who wrap their ignorance in the wrapper of being someone that adheres to the word of their god, and do horrible things to their fellow man. If there is a god, and you get to meet him face to face, I hope he bitch slaps you around for being such assholes towards your fellow man. His teachings are about love, not hate. It's about inclusion, not exclusion. It's about helping your fellow man, not beating them down. And if your god is so powerful and almighty, he certainly doesn't need idiots fighting his battles, in his name. He's a big boy, he'll take care of judgement against others. Go do something to HELP people instead of beating people down.
I treat people properly, I help people instead of cause harm. and I don't need to wrap myself up in being a christian to do it. I do it because that's why we're all here, to help each other out, because it's the decent thing to do to others.
Again, I have no patience for people wrapping themselves in religion so they have justification to cause harm to others.
SECOND RANT:
I keep getting dragged into winless arguments over this. In order to save me hours and hours of typing in circles, I'll put it really simply.
If you have religious beliefs, and you use these beliefs to impose your beliefs on others, either by trying to pass laws, or use these beliefs to belittle and bully others, you suck.
If you quote words from your holy book as some sort of divine final say on a subject, you need to remember- not everyone believes in a super being, and not everyone follows that same flavor of religion as you do. The other guy's book is just as right, or just as wrong, as yours.
With that said, if you profess to be a righteous man or woman of God, a Good Christian, who's life is based on how you walk the walk of Jesus, and use that as your self identification, then you need to believe the words in that book fully.
If you aren't 100% behind every single words, without a convenient interpretation of those words, then you aren't a true believer, you aren't a true Christian, and you're a hypocrite. If you believe every word of Leviticus, then I don't have a problem. So if you're going to quote a passage you say means homosexuality is a sin, then you'd damn well better also believe, with equal passion and conviction, the other bits of Leviticus.
Don’t quote Leviticus to back up your justification for hatred and condemnation. In Galatians, Paul says we are no longer under the Law. Paul said Leviticus is the yoke of slavery, Galatians 5:1. So by quoting Leviticus, you're quoting scripture that Jesus said no longer applies, it's old law, which isn't to be followed. Paul taught that we are no longer under the Law. Period.
There is a big problem with quoting Leviticus. Christians are no longer under the Law. Christians don't live their life by following the Old Testament Law. The Apostle Paul makes this very clear. It is not something fabricated to win an argument, or made up in the twentieth century, or manufactured to get around something somebody doesn’t like. It is clearly stated in the Greek scriptures. The Apostle Paul wrote it in Galatians:
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse- “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” (Galatians 3:10)
With that in mind, if you're still going to dig up and use the clobber scriptures in Leviticus to lay claim that all these gays and lesbians are sinners, because the bible says so, then you'd better follow ALL the words above and below that bit of scripture.
Leviticus 11:1-12, where all unclean animals are forbidden as food, including rabbits, pigs, and shellfish, such as oysters, shrimp, lobsters, crabs, clams, and others that are called an "abomination."
Leviticus 12:1-8 declares that a woman is unclean for 33 days after giving birth to a boy and for 66 days after giving birth to a girl and goes on to demand that certain animals must be offered as a burnt offering and a sin offering for cleansing.
Leviticus 18:19 forbids a husband from having sex with his wife during her menstrual period.
Leviticus 19:19 forbids mixed breeding of various kinds of cattle, sowing various kinds of seeds in your field or wearing "a garment made from two kinds of material mixed together."
Leviticus 19:27 demands that "you shall not round off the side-growth of your heads, nor harm the edges of your beard." The next verse forbids "tattoo marks on yourself."
Leviticus 26:14-16 that "If you do not obey me and do not carry out all of these commandments, if instead, you reject my statutes, and if your soul abhors my ordinances so as not to carry out all my commandments ...I, in turn, will do this to you: I will appoint over you a sudden terror, consumption and fever that shall waste away the eyes and cause the soul to pine away; also, you shall sow your seed uselessly, for your enemies shall eat it up."
Jesus said in Matthew 7:1-5
"Do not judge lest you be judged yourselves... Why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?"
So you'd better not be eating pork, or shrimp or crabs, you'd better not be cutting your hair, you'd better not be having sex during "that time" of the month, you'd better not be wearing a cotton polyester blend pair of pants, you'd better not have ink on your skin, or a trimmed beard, and you'd better be tossing animals onto a bonfire out back as an offering for cleansing.
If you're doing any of this, then you are a hypocrite. There's no maybe, or sort of, it's cut and dried. You want to cause people grief because you have such strict beliefs, then you'd better damn well be walking the WHOLE walk. Otherwise, you're talking out of your ass. Really, it's either A or B, Yes or No.
Jesus does not want you judging squat. God is a big boy, and he can fight his own battles. You're using scripture that isn't supposed to be followed, that according to Jesus' brother James. So if you're going to use this bit to try to force your beliefs onto others, you'd better damn well be following ALL of it, no exceptions. ALL OF IT.
This horse is long dead, but I've finally been able to gel all the issues with the BS being flung around lately with SCRIPTURE that people are supposedly following. If you wanna argue, save your breath, I'm done slamming my head into unyielding walls.
Not everyone marries in a church. And Barry, you need to do some studying, marriage was around long before the supposed birth of Jesus. It was a contract, often between men by the way, that handled the legality of property.
Also, my wife and I were married by the Justice of the Peace. God had no place, and nothing to do, with our wedding ceremony.
The thing that you, and so many others can't seem to get through your heads- just because YOU believe in your favor of God, and you think it's wrong, who the hell are you to try to pass laws to prevent people that love each other to have the same basic rights as you? In my world, there is love, and there is hatred. There is nothing in the bible saying to judge, or hate others, on god's behalf. There's nothing in there that says to condemn others, hurt others, make the lives of others more miserable on god's behalf.
Bottom line- people using religion to condemn others is wrong. People quoting antiquated passages in a dusty old book can't pick and choose what to believe. Stop eating pork, stop eating shellfish, stop wearing clothing of mixed materials, if you die, your brother marries your wife, take multiple wives,etc. Follow your word of god to the letter, or get off your soapbox. Seriously, if you're going to persecute people based on beliefs, then fucking believe and follow those same laws, the ones written just before and just after the crap you're throwing around as justification for your hatred.
Not everyone believes in god. Not everyone believes in YOUR flavor of god. Not everyone believes the same teachings as you do. Your beliefs are not the default beliefs of the rest of the world. Your beliefs are just as flawed as the other guy's beliefs. You are not right by default. Religions doesn't go with freaking majority rule. Just saying that X amount of people in the world are christians doesn't mean that you're right. It doesn't make your ideas right by default. People are up in arms over the belief system of Muslims. Guess what? THEY think THEY'RE right, and that their religion is the right one, the default religion, the true religion.
What does that mean? It means the world is filled with people following half assed belief systems, each group knowing for SURE that their flavor of god is the right one. Which means the world is filled with groups of people that are entirely wrong in the eyes of the rest of the world. Which means there is room in the world for people with other belief systems than your personal beliefs. You don't fucking condemn people to a life of misery because YOU think your god says it's ok to do so.
The longer I'm on the face of this earth, the more I am filled with anger against self righteous people, clueless individuals who wrap their ignorance in the wrapper of being someone that adheres to the word of their god, and do horrible things to their fellow man. If there is a god, and you get to meet him face to face, I hope he bitch slaps you around for being such assholes towards your fellow man. His teachings are about love, not hate. It's about inclusion, not exclusion. It's about helping your fellow man, not beating them down. And if your god is so powerful and almighty, he certainly doesn't need idiots fighting his battles, in his name. He's a big boy, he'll take care of judgement against others. Go do something to HELP people instead of beating people down.
I treat people properly, I help people instead of cause harm. and I don't need to wrap myself up in being a christian to do it. I do it because that's why we're all here, to help each other out, because it's the decent thing to do to others.
Again, I have no patience for people wrapping themselves in religion so they have justification to cause harm to others.
SECOND RANT:
I keep getting dragged into winless arguments over this. In order to save me hours and hours of typing in circles, I'll put it really simply.
If you have religious beliefs, and you use these beliefs to impose your beliefs on others, either by trying to pass laws, or use these beliefs to belittle and bully others, you suck.
If you quote words from your holy book as some sort of divine final say on a subject, you need to remember- not everyone believes in a super being, and not everyone follows that same flavor of religion as you do. The other guy's book is just as right, or just as wrong, as yours.
With that said, if you profess to be a righteous man or woman of God, a Good Christian, who's life is based on how you walk the walk of Jesus, and use that as your self identification, then you need to believe the words in that book fully.
If you aren't 100% behind every single words, without a convenient interpretation of those words, then you aren't a true believer, you aren't a true Christian, and you're a hypocrite. If you believe every word of Leviticus, then I don't have a problem. So if you're going to quote a passage you say means homosexuality is a sin, then you'd damn well better also believe, with equal passion and conviction, the other bits of Leviticus.
Don’t quote Leviticus to back up your justification for hatred and condemnation. In Galatians, Paul says we are no longer under the Law. Paul said Leviticus is the yoke of slavery, Galatians 5:1. So by quoting Leviticus, you're quoting scripture that Jesus said no longer applies, it's old law, which isn't to be followed. Paul taught that we are no longer under the Law. Period.
There is a big problem with quoting Leviticus. Christians are no longer under the Law. Christians don't live their life by following the Old Testament Law. The Apostle Paul makes this very clear. It is not something fabricated to win an argument, or made up in the twentieth century, or manufactured to get around something somebody doesn’t like. It is clearly stated in the Greek scriptures. The Apostle Paul wrote it in Galatians:
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse- “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” (Galatians 3:10)
With that in mind, if you're still going to dig up and use the clobber scriptures in Leviticus to lay claim that all these gays and lesbians are sinners, because the bible says so, then you'd better follow ALL the words above and below that bit of scripture.
Leviticus 11:1-12, where all unclean animals are forbidden as food, including rabbits, pigs, and shellfish, such as oysters, shrimp, lobsters, crabs, clams, and others that are called an "abomination."
Leviticus 12:1-8 declares that a woman is unclean for 33 days after giving birth to a boy and for 66 days after giving birth to a girl and goes on to demand that certain animals must be offered as a burnt offering and a sin offering for cleansing.
Leviticus 18:19 forbids a husband from having sex with his wife during her menstrual period.
Leviticus 19:19 forbids mixed breeding of various kinds of cattle, sowing various kinds of seeds in your field or wearing "a garment made from two kinds of material mixed together."
Leviticus 19:27 demands that "you shall not round off the side-growth of your heads, nor harm the edges of your beard." The next verse forbids "tattoo marks on yourself."
Leviticus 26:14-16 that "If you do not obey me and do not carry out all of these commandments, if instead, you reject my statutes, and if your soul abhors my ordinances so as not to carry out all my commandments ...I, in turn, will do this to you: I will appoint over you a sudden terror, consumption and fever that shall waste away the eyes and cause the soul to pine away; also, you shall sow your seed uselessly, for your enemies shall eat it up."
Jesus said in Matthew 7:1-5
"Do not judge lest you be judged yourselves... Why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?"
So you'd better not be eating pork, or shrimp or crabs, you'd better not be cutting your hair, you'd better not be having sex during "that time" of the month, you'd better not be wearing a cotton polyester blend pair of pants, you'd better not have ink on your skin, or a trimmed beard, and you'd better be tossing animals onto a bonfire out back as an offering for cleansing.
If you're doing any of this, then you are a hypocrite. There's no maybe, or sort of, it's cut and dried. You want to cause people grief because you have such strict beliefs, then you'd better damn well be walking the WHOLE walk. Otherwise, you're talking out of your ass. Really, it's either A or B, Yes or No.
Jesus does not want you judging squat. God is a big boy, and he can fight his own battles. You're using scripture that isn't supposed to be followed, that according to Jesus' brother James. So if you're going to use this bit to try to force your beliefs onto others, you'd better damn well be following ALL of it, no exceptions. ALL OF IT.
This horse is long dead, but I've finally been able to gel all the issues with the BS being flung around lately with SCRIPTURE that people are supposedly following. If you wanna argue, save your breath, I'm done slamming my head into unyielding walls.
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Date: 2012-08-03 02:14 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2012-08-03 03:41 am (UTC)From:And I just added a second one.
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Date: 2012-08-03 11:03 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2012-08-03 12:43 pm (UTC)From:YES.
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Date: 2012-08-04 04:01 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2012-08-05 04:19 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2012-08-05 08:52 am (UTC)From: